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Poll
While I was at college I:
Drank lots of beer and got a young girl pregnant. 8%
Drank lots of beer, smoked pot and got a young girl pregnant 0%
Drank lots of beer, smoked pot, skipped class and got a young girl pregnant 9%
Drank lots of beer, smoked pot, skipped class, crashed my father's car and got a young girl pregnant 1%
Drank lots of beer, smoked pot, skipped class, crashed my father's car, sold drugs and got a young girl pregnant 1%
Drank lots of beer, smoked pot, skipped class, crashed my father's car, sold drugs, went to rock concerts and got a young girl pregnant 9%
Drank lots of beer, smoked pot, skipped class, crashed my father's car, sold drugs, went to rock concerts, hazed freshmen and got a young girl pregnant 53%
Had an abortion. 14%

Votes: 155

 My Children Will Not Be Attending College

 Author:  Topic:  Posted:
Jan 21, 2002
 Comments:
Like most American parents, I have been diligently saving for my childrens' education since the day when each was born. Believing, as we are told, that a college education is not merely desirable, but actually necessary for the betterment of my offspring, I knew I was doing the only responsible thing a parent could do. With six wonderful children, it was not unreasonable, I felt, to expect to be the only family in town to give rise to a lawyer, a doctor, a quarterback, an elementary school teacher, a cheerleader and a nurse.

Over the past few years, however, my dreams of academic success have begun to look a more than a little naive. A growing disapproval of the manner in which our college educated young present themselves began a process of disillusionment which ended with my decision to refuse my eldest the "advantage" of college this coming Fall. The events that brought this situation to a head occurred last Thanksgiving, when my neighbour's daughter, Blair, returned home for the first time since she had left to attend MIT that year.

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T Reginald Gibbons

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I remember watching Blair grow up alongside my own children. Though older than them all, she was a fine playmate for my girls, and since her parents are quite devout, I had no qualms about her giving my children any strange ideas. I remember a freckled and knee-skinned eight year old, riding bikes with my eldest daughter on our avenue beneath the sycamores in their Springtime glory. I watched her as she went through her awkward teenage years, uncertain and confused. The proudest memory we have of her is as a young woman, freshly home from finishing school, before she was sent off to receive a higher education. I had my qualms about her parents' decision to allow her to attend MIT, a notoriously secular university, but these were settled when some brief investigation revealed that MIT was considered to be even more conformist than Berkeley. So, it was with a proud smile and a merry wave that my family watched young Blair leave our town to seek her destiny in the halls of academe. Little did we realise that the girl who would return to us would not be the same radiant young woman whose memory we had cherished.

It wasn't until Thanksgiving dinner, which our families traditionally eat together, that I met young Blair again. The aggrieved expression on her father, Miles' face was all the first hint that this would not be the joyful reunion we had expected. Minutes later, Blair was coaxed downstairs by her mother. The sight of her left us all quite taken aback. Gone was the long, strawberry-blonde hair that had made her the envy and delight of all her peers. It had been cropped to barely shoulder length and dyed fiercely black. Her once radiant skin was now sickly pale, giving the impression, I felt, of a subterranean lifestyle. She dressed in the anti-social style of a militant nonconformist; in purple boots, grey army-style pants and a heavy, drab wool sweater.

Throughout dinner, young Blair was a sullen presence at the table, casting a pall on what should have been a convivial evening. She was monosyllabic in her replies to questions about college. Her face was constantly downturned, as though she wanted to pretend there was nobody else present at the table. When I asked her about the boys she had met at college, and if she was having finding any good husband material, she finally looked up, only to give me the most angry, hurt stare I have ever had from a young woman. The whites of her eyes were very red, as though she had been crying for hours, and her lip trembled, as if she were on the verge of saying something, but she obviously thought better of it, and returned to resolutely studying her dinner plate. It was then that I realised that something terrible had happened to her at college, most likely at the hands of heartless college men.

How could a few months of college change a person so completely? As much as it hurt me, I knew that I could not allow the drastically altered attitudes of young Blair to affect my family. I would not allow my children to be so irrevocably damaged. With heartfelt apologies to Miles, I told my children that they were not allowed to see Blair ever again. The strident complaints of my three daughters told me I had made the correct decision. Already they had begun to be drawn to her attitude of teenage rebellion. It felt good to know that I had acted in time to save them.

Of course, I was shaken enough by the events of Thanksgiving to begin reassessing the pros and cons of a college education for my children. The misgivings I had been feeling over the past few years now seemed more well-grounded, while the benefits of college had taken on the aspect of wishful thinking. Was it really worth the risk, to send my children away, to pay tens of thousands for an education that they might not even get?

Americans have not always harboured college ambitions for their progeny. Until the 1960s, it was not common to meet college graduates. Even though the GI benefits program provides for college education for returning soldiers, most of those who survived WW2 did not exercise those particular benefits. College ambition was simply not part of the American culture, until the Sixties.

It was thanks to the Vietnam war that college became the expected continuation of a middle class child's life. With the new SAT program opening possibilities that had once been restricted to the children of privileged families, more students took it upon themselves to seek acceptance in tertiary institutions. Coupled with the fact that college entry delayed the draft for as long as the child was at college, it is easy to see why America in the Sixties saw such a massive rise in college applications. A rise so unexpected and so large that the nation was forced to almost bankrupt itself to build state colleges to accept the middle class children fleeing the war.

What did this leave us with? A well educated middle class? Alas, no. The result of the boom in education has been a tide of smug, mistaught state college graduates, who consider themselves to be the example of the modern intellectual, despite having spent their entire three years at college indulging their basest appetites and avoiding any form of learning. Not that avoiding learning is difficult in America's state colleges. These institutions have never been known for their high academic standards.After the war ended, the college system's primary function -- to provide a shelter from the draft -- ceased. Even so, the state colleges have remained little more than degree mills and pretentious sleep-away schools for spoiled middle American teenagers who want to delay growing up for a few more years.

As the college graduates of those turbulent years raise their own children to college age, they of course look back on their college years as the best time of their lives. Having based much of their self-esteem on their all-but-worthless degrees, they naturally see college as the logical next step for their children, and encourage them to attend whatever liberal arts course they feel like. No doubt, they imagine college will transform their child into the next Susan Sontag or P. J. O'Rourke. Of course, they have forgotten that their presence at college was not for the sake of education, but was born of the cowardice that bought our nation its first ever military defeat.

It is this misapprehension about the purpose of education that has sustained our college system through the last three decades, however, as the nineties drew to a close, the tide of children born of parents who had attended college in the Sixties began to dry up. America's colleges and even our most revered universities have begun to feel the squeeze, as too many institutions compete for too few students. It is this highly competitive environment that has caused some of our most respected institutions to start selling degrees.

It was not long after I first began using the internet that I received my first offer of a college degree for no more than twenty dollars. Apparently, this practice has become common among educational institutions, and the only difference now between a Harvard degree and one from a degree mill such as Carnegie-Mellon is the price you pay. A depressing state of affairs, offering no plausible benefits to my children. I will not have my flesh and blood participate in this hypocrisy.

And what of the supposed benefits of education? While the dreams of success that draw hundreds of thousands to college may be compelling, the facts are not so attractive. Most college graduates don't amount to much more than a mediocre success in the real world. On the other hand, we are always hearing tales of people such as Bill Gates who did not attend college -- or sometimes even finish high school -- achieving incredible wealth and fame.

The educational institutions of America have little to offer but disillusionment and corruption. While a properly educated elite is necessary for society to function well, the state college system has done little to advance the education of our leaders, and much to undermine not only knowledge and truth in these United States, but also the prestige that education brings. Offering literally hundreds of soft option courses such as psychology and astrophysics, the modern American student has become renowned not for learning, but for indolence and immaturity. Even the SAT examination -- the basis of college entry -- has been "updated" to be composed almost entirely of multiple choice questions, so easily guessed that cheating (not to mention learning) is almost pointless. American revolving door colleges are quite clearly making a mockery of our nation's proud heritage.

In our modern colleges, children are turned against their parents, and taught to hate society. Loving and respectful young men and women are returned to their parents hateful and withdrawn. So-called sexual "liberation" (really a euphemism for institutionalized rape) abounds within college dormitories, and no effort is made to control underage drinking and drug abuse. I shiver at the thought of what might befall poor Blair when she returns to college. When we see her again I worry that she will have become addicted to narcotics such as marijuana, heroin or smack. I cannot allow my children to fall into the same trap.

Since the illusion of college has been so effectively shattered for me, I have revised my expectations for my children. None will attend college, but instead, they will find jobs in the industries that made America great. The industries upon which our nation was built. I will be proud to be the first father in my town to count among my children an auto-worker, a soldier, a steel miner, a secretary, a beautician and a waitress. These are noble and honest trades, despite their unglamorous image.

If I were a more powerful man, I would do more. I would call for the dismantling of the state college system. I would demand a drastic reduction in our government's education budget. I would fight tooth and nail to keep our nation's children out of college. I am, however, no more than a humble father of six, and I can only try to protect what is my own.

T Reginald Gibbons is a pseudonym. No matter what you think, you do not have his email address or phone number.


You are right to be wary of MIT (5.00 / 2) (#13)
by Adam Rightmann on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 07:27:11 AM PST
It's a hotbed of Communism and secular humanistic values. Any university that allows an unredeemed communist like Richard M. Stalinman to sleep in the offices and preach the destruction of the corporate state (while accepting billions from said corporate state) without censure is dangerously ubalanced and hypocritical.

But there are several good universities and colleges you can consider; Notre Dame, Boston College, Catholic University, Georgetown and Loyola all have splendid programs in place for raising a Godly child.


A. Rightmann

Caveat (5.00 / 1) (#14)
by hauntedattics on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 08:03:46 AM PST
Mr. Rightmann, you are right, of course. However, I live 2 miles from the Boston College campus and have to admit that I have occasionally seen undergraduates there behaving in a way that is less than Godly. Maybe they should increase the number of required Religion and Theology courses.

Oh, and Mr. Gibbons, one of my colleagues is a recent MIT grad but did somehow manage to become a fine, upstanding citizen and member of society. So the outlook may not be as bleak as you think.



ROTC (5.00 / 2) (#17)
by doofus on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 09:17:43 AM PST
However, I live 2 miles from the Boston College campus and have to admit that I have occasionally seen undergraduates there behaving in a way that is less than Godly. Maybe they should increase the number of required Religion and Theology courses.

In addition, I am quite sure 4 years of ROTC (preferably Army, Navy or Marine Corps, but Air Force would be acceptable in a pinch) and then another 4 years of serving their country proudly would straighten them up.


 
Well, now that you mention it (5.00 / 1) (#23)
by Adam Rightmann on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 10:53:13 AM PST
The wife and I did spend a few days in Boston very near to Boston College, in the Howard Johnson's near Fenway Park. It was in October of perhaps 1998, The White Sox has been out of the pennant races a few weeks earlier, and rooms were cheap. This was the year that Matthew Sheppard had been killed, a shame, for he did to have the chance to repent of his sins before being murdered (I recall this for we were walking down Massachusetts Ave in neighboring Cambridge, and inadvertantly walked through the MIT campus and into a Matthew Sheppard memorial service, which we respectfully joined, with genuine regret I might add). Anyhow, we attempted to have breakfast at the International House of Pancakes near the BC subway entrance, only to flee the place after finding straw papers in the coffee. Those undergraduate hijinks, I do hope those children mature. We settled for a Bruegger's across the street, I'm sure you know the one we're talking about.


A. Rightmann

I think... (5.00 / 1) (#39)
by hauntedattics on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 06:13:51 AM PST
you are thinking of BU, or Boston University, which is very close to Fenway (and across the river from MIT). There is a difference - BU tends to attract spoiled, whiny rich kids who want to get an 'education' while living 'in the city.' Despite its name, BC is located a few miles west of Boston and tends to attract more serious and interesting students. Some of its alumni I am proud to call my friends.

However, as I said in my previous post, many BC students are not always serious and interesting, depending on the hour and day you observe them.




You are right, I was confusing BC and BU (5.00 / 1) (#40)
by Adam Rightmann on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 07:38:37 AM PST
Which explains why we did not see a football stadium in that area.


A. Rightmann

 
Ware the heathen! (5.00 / 1) (#42)
by Jon Erikson on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 09:03:23 AM PST
Listen not to his cultish lies!

No, as a decent Christian and proud USian the only possible choice of college is Bob Jones University, perhaps the last place of education in USia that recognises and indeed cherishes the Love of our Lord. I myself was educated there, and learnt the fine Christian values of tolerance, dignity and morality that has made me the man I am today.


Jon Erikson
Senior consultant, NPO Technologies


 
Loyola!? HA!! (1.00 / 1) (#55)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Jan 24th, 2002 at 05:43:21 PM PST
Some of the best sluts I know are from Loyola.
Better luck nexyt timw


 
Don't send your kids to my school (none / 0) (#100)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu May 23rd, 2002 at 03:45:57 PM PST
Adam Rightmann:
It's a free world. The USA was born because of people who didn't like the things around them. Your comments are nothing more than racist, classist, ignorant beliefs of a man brainwashed by the catholic church and a lacking concept of the world asround him. Grow up.

TRG:
Dont send your freak kids to my school (Catholic University). Jesus christ - you're a nut job and Im sure your children are just as bad. You have to let go of your kids sometime and let them grow up on their own.

PS: Notre Dame, Boston College, Catholic University, Georgetown and Loyola are all breeding grounds for whores and drinking problems for you dumb church freaks. Your kids will get here - interact with other kids - and actually develop a social awarnes! Oh no! Most of which leads to freshman turning into whores and alocholics.


 
Might I ask... (1.00 / 1) (#15)
by budlite on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 08:09:42 AM PST
...What do you plan for them instead?

What's the problem with your kids going off and becoming their own people? College (or University as we Brits call it) is probably the best place for a person to go to form their own ideas about who they want to be rather than having them forced on them by people who just want to see only their own views expounded by others.

Conformity isn't the only way of life.


Well Said (1.00 / 1) (#16)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 08:28:09 AM PST
<i>Conformity isn't the only way of life.</i><br>
Very well said.


 
what? (5.00 / 2) (#22)
by nathan on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 10:23:00 AM PST
College (or University as we Brits call it) is probably the best place for a person to go to form their own ideas about who they want to be...

That's funny, most undergrads seem to spend their time on panty raids, stein hoists, music theft, hair dyeing, and recreational STD-swapping. I should have guessed it was all a cover for rigorous philosophical and religious development. Who'd have thought that the best way to acquire an education was to go to an overgrown summer camp for four years? Such luminaries as Shakespeare and Einstein seem to have managed despite lacking that competitive advantage. (Before you get on your high horse, Einstein did not attend a "university," he attended a "technical institute.")

Mr. Gibbons' point is well taken. I hold an honours degree from a nationally-ranked American school, and I can confidently say that most of my classes were the next thing to useless. I would have been better off just reading books on my own (not that I didn't do that anyway.) My only fond memories are of one old philosophy professor who made us read the Greek classics closely, quickly, and sceptically. The other classes were trendy, windy, tedious, and tendentiously contrived.

Universities ought to teach people to think, but they've failed to do so for at least thirty years.

Nathan
--
Li'l Sis: Yo, that's a real grey area. Even by my lax standards.

I'm confused (1.00 / 1) (#24)
by budlite on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 01:01:17 PM PST
Are you referring to US colleges or UK universities in your first paragraph? If it's UK universities I'll say right now that what you say is a result of rather poor observation of the majority of students.

Otherwise I'll admit that I can't really speak the case for US colleges, not having attended one (or indeed been outside Europe).


Allow me to explain (5.00 / 1) (#29)
by error27 on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 02:44:18 PM PST
The first paragraph was a quote from the parent comment, hence the italics.

The rest of the post was meant to refute the first paragraph because unless getting drunk is the same thing as forming ideas, few students form anything even vaguely resembling ideas while attending university.




Agree... (1.00 / 1) (#37)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 05:32:41 AM PST
As a first year university student, I totally agree... I'm not learning a thing which will be useful outside of University, whether living life in general or whatever corporate meatgrinder I end up in at a crap "graduate" position.

Messing with Linux for 6 months and reading Bugtraq will prepare you better for IT industry work (poking buttons like the monkey you are) than 3 years on the average compsci degree (useless theoretical paper-pushing).

However, never one to pass up an opportunity in life, three years of subsidised drinking, sex, and shopping in a veritable drugs supermarket was too much to pass up. Ha!


Subsidised? (1.00 / 1) (#41)
by budlite on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 08:26:45 AM PST
Naah. It's not. It's an exercise in getting in debt big time. Thankfully through planning I've managed to stay in the black but most other people I know are well into their overdrafts.


 
quick question (5.00 / 1) (#45)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 07:45:55 PM PST
Messing with Linux for 6 months and reading Bugtraq will prepare you better for IT industry work

Wouldnt it be wiser to mess with OS that is used in the IT industry? I believe the only place Linux is used is on 0.24% of all desktops.


Not necessarily... (1.00 / 1) (#51)
by budlite on Thu Jan 24th, 2002 at 07:45:44 AM PST
I believe it's wiser to get at least a grounding in as many OS's as possible, simply because a particular OS is the industry standard doesn't mean I'm going to end up somewhere that exclusively uses that OS in the future.

Plus there's the fun element of it. I enjoy using computers. I also enjoy experimenting with new software, and if that software happens to be an OS then I'll generally give it a shot. Linux is fun to play around with. The fact that it isn't quite up to the standards of Windows in terms of user-friendlyness just makes it all the more enjoyable to use, it's fun creating your own tools to make life that little bit easier and they're more satisfying to use because thry do exactly what YOU want. If a free program you use doesn't do exactly what you want then you're generally free to modify it (licenses permitting) to suit your needs.

I notice you only chose to mention that Linux isn't often used on the desktop to make your weak point. One of Linux's best uses is as a server OS, and it's no secret that a significant percentage of web servers and even critical back-end servers run Linux. I've certainly don't know of any educational institutes that don't use Linux or a Unix variant somewhere in the computer system.


 
Satire or sad? (1.00 / 1) (#18)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 09:18:51 AM PST
I can't quite make up my mind if this is an excellent piece of satire or the product of a very sad conformist seeing someone make up their own mind.


Very good (5.00 / 4) (#19)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 09:22:55 AM PST
I see you haven't attended college either.


 
Small correction (1.00 / 1) (#20)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 10:07:21 AM PST
In the War of 1812 the British burned Washington DC. I believe that was the first conflict we ever lost, not Vietnam. The Alamo might also have bearing here.

As for your children's education, how can you forget Bob Jones University. Granted they have recently relaxed their Interracial Dating Policy, however that was just to help George Bush get the mandate he deserved. The odds of having to deal with minorites would be less at Bob Jones than as a steel worker, or a beautician.

Just food for thought.



LostBoy
jim


And that's why we have a Queen (5.00 / 3) (#21)
by Adam Rightmann on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 10:21:53 AM PST
In the War of 1812 the British burned Washington DC. I believe that was the first conflict we ever lost, not Vietnam. The Alamo might also have bearing here.

Please good sir, post your alma mater so that we know enough not to send our progeny there. If the US lost the War of 1812, why did we stay independent? You may be able to make the case that the war was a draw, but in the end, the revolting colonies stayed free, and that sounds like a win to me.

If you are talking about the first battle the US was lost, I'm sure there were many in the Revolutionary War.

As far as the Alamo goes, I don't believe Texas was a part of the union at the time, so or course the US was not officially involved.

I would not recommend Bob Jobs University to my worst enemy; the pain of eternal torment for persecuting Catholics (to a degree unseen since Henry the 8th) will surely fall even on the meekest undergraduate.


A. Rightmann

That's why Canada do not have a president (1.00 / 1) (#25)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 01:23:23 PM PST
The US indeed lost that war.
1809 : James Madison elected president.
1810 : Henry Clay, John C. Calhoun are congressmen.
All those men believed that America, from the gulf of Mexico to the North Pole has to be under the Stars ans Stripes. They are known as the war hawks. Interested by the rich land, thinking that there was not such people as Canadians, except the french speaking inhabitants willing to be freed from Great Britain, as everybody else in the north, and Great Britain being at war with France at that very moment, convinced the Congress to declare war on Great Britain.
They were very surprised when they discovered that the Canadians, French or not, didn't want to be freed at all.

See here : http://members.tripod.com/~war1812/



Idiot (5.00 / 1) (#26)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 01:38:12 PM PST
The US did not lose the war of 1812. Of course we didn't outright win it either. The British ended the campaign simply because it was costing too much money and resources that were needed against the war with France. The only major battle that the US did win in the war of 1812 was the battle of New Orleans (a victory that would propel Andrew Jackson to near godly status), which actually took place after the war was officially over but do to slow communications took place anyway.


I may be (1.00 / 1) (#27)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 01:47:48 PM PST
An idiot. It is very stupid to think there must be a loser and a winner in a war. But, since the US declared war to free Canada, and assimilate it, a goal they didn't achieve at all, and since the war ended, because Great Britain, too busy in Europe, said so, pardon me, my dear and very polite Sir, if I consider that The US lost that war.
(By the way, New Orleans, the British knew about the peace)


You're no idiot (5.00 / 1) (#28)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 01:58:49 PM PST
In 1814 we took a little trip, down the Mississippi to the town of New Orleans. If it hadn't been for that 'gator, we would have lost the war.


LEARN YOUR HISTORY (1.00 / 1) (#32)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 05:22:09 PM PST
I suggest you retake history. In the war of 1812 the Canadian infantry took a walk down to your nations capital and burned the whitehouse ot the ground. It should be Chicago Ontario however the Americans bitched and whined until we decided to give your piece of shit land back


Haha... why don't YOU learn YOUR history? (none / 0) (#74)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Jan 30th, 2002 at 06:25:18 PM PST
The Brits made a naval assault up the Potomac. Not a Canadian over-land assault. And no, we did not lose that war. We reaffirmed our independence from Britain. If we had lost that war, you'd be singing God Bless the King right now.

And no, Canada doesn't have a President. It has a Prime Minister. Since Britain has a PM instead of a President, does that make it a puppet state or whatever?


 
Public U.? (5.00 / 1) (#30)
by First Incision on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 03:54:16 PM PST
Why this constant complaining about public Universities? The obvious solution is to have your children attend a private, Christian University.

At places such as these, you will find an administration attempting to set up a moral institution. This includes such things as separate dorms for men and women and filtered internet access.

Don't underestimate the power of peer pressure. Why are sex and alcoholism not rampant on Samford U.'s campus (my Alma Mater)? It is not because of the efforts by the administration (although these efforsts factor in.) The students are kept in line by the students themselves. The few times I tried to drink alcohol with friends from Samford, I was made to feel very self-conscious and uncomfortable. If it was found out that a couple was fornicating, they could expect several friends armed with bibles to try and help them through their temptation.

I have had several friends transfer away from Samford to a cheaper public school. They usually come back, because they realize just how godless these schools are.

I highly reccommend a private Christian college to anyone who wants to learn without being corrupted.
_
_
Do you suffer from late-night hacking? Ask your doctor about Protonix.

wha? (none / 0) (#84)
by Anonymous Reader on Sun Feb 10th, 2002 at 02:53:42 PM PST
filter internet access? who needs that? plus you can get around anything if you want to bad enough.


 
College and cowardice (5.00 / 1) (#31)
by Anonymous Coward on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 04:25:29 PM PST
their presence at college was not for the sake of education, but was born of the cowardice that bought our nation its first ever military defeat.

As a coward, I must speak out against the knee-jerk pejorative use of this epithet in your provocative article. You hide behind a pseudonym yet you demean the cowardice of others. Of course you are right to hide your identity in a world where college students and other hooligans would likely be ordering pizza for you or otherwise wasting their lives in acts of destruction toward your person. But you correctly take the coward's way out and deny them that opportunity, and as a coward, I salute you.


-- Support the home page homeless.

 
I have a question. (5.00 / 1) (#33)
by elenchos on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 05:43:07 PM PST
I am constantly seeing posts saying that most or even all of the courses the poster took in college were useless. I see this everywhere, although I think I see it a little more on Slashdot and K5 than on, say, Plastic or the MSN boards. It makes me wonder.

Just when did you figure out that these courses were useless? You would think that a useless course would be easy to recognize at the time that you were taking it. You would think that the person taking the course would at least begin to suspect somethign was amiss, if not during the first useless course, then maybe after the second or third one. Wouldn't you think?

But no. It seems that lots of people go and get whole degrees, taking forty or more of these useless courses, at a cost of $300 to $1500 or even more per course. And around $80 for books, if you're lucky. Often it's more like $150. But whatever, its not chicken feed. It's a lot of money to blow on something useless, and then there's all the time and effort involoved. Do I need to go into detail?

So what is up with that? You're telling me you're smart enough to realize that college was a big waste of time and money, but you weren't smart enough to go and spend your time and money on something that is worthwhile? Seems like only an idiot would waste all that. And if you're an idiot, what does that say aobut your ability to judge the value of college? If you're an idiot, would any college course be any use to you?

It seems like no matter how you try to work it out, it ends up as a paradox.

For myself, I've spend a fortune on college and put more of my time and effort into that than anything else in my life, and don't regret it at all. I plan to spend more on it in the future, in fact. Smart or dumb?


I do, I do, I do
--Bikini Kill


the answer (5.00 / 1) (#34)
by nathan on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 06:01:41 PM PST
I don't know about you, elenchos, but I went to college because my parents wanted me to, and to have hot and cold running chicks, in that order.

Nathan
--
Li'l Sis: Yo, that's a real grey area. Even by my lax standards.

Wow. (5.00 / 1) (#38)
by hauntedattics on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 06:03:14 AM PST
Ya know, I went to college because my parents wanted me to, and to score some hot guys. Cold guys weren't really on my menu back then, and still aren't.



 
rebuttal (none / 0) (#87)
by Anonymous Reader on Sun Feb 17th, 2002 at 08:06:55 PM PST
I think college is pretty useless too, but I need it to get a better job.. am I going to get a good job with no education and only menial jobs on my resume? I don't think so.

It's just like the emperor's new clothes.


 
Not to mention... (2.00 / 1) (#35)
by Dr William King on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 10:17:43 PM PST
Not to mention that the liberal-minded culture of the sixties contributed ironically to the ridiculization of our valued liberal profession.

Now lawyers, nurses, cheerleaders and quarterbacks aside are portrayed in pornographic photographies and or films as what I called in my research : «The sexual American dream».

It is disgusting to blame with pornography well-potent christian men and women who contribute to the evolution of our capitalist system, making it a far more free and friendly place every day.

<STRONG>Dr. William King</STRONG>


just to be clear (2.00 / 1) (#36)
by Dr William King on Mon Jan 21st, 2002 at 10:27:18 PM PST
Of course my friends the STRONGs were intended to be seen like that... and let'S not start an argument about religion and traditional values here like we could.


 
Aren't you the guy who posted the.... (3.00 / 2) (#43)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 05:44:08 PM PST
'Is your son a computer Hacker' article?
I thought I recognized your style, you paranoid and delusional 'so right-winged-you-fell-off-the-airplane' bastard. Yes, state colleges are for idiots, but places like Harvard etc. are still highly respectable. You can only get these idiotic $20 Diplomas from state colleges, not any college you want. I think someone should set up a fund for your children, and a petition that you be removed from society because you are a menace to it. How could you FORCE your children into lower-class jobs (no insult to any who may hold the positions named)???
Furthermore, in you're tale of the self made man, i noticed that you specifically mentioned Bill Gates, meaning you are a hypocryte. By your definition in your 'Is Your Son a Computer Hacker?' article, Bill Gates is a terrible hacker. Please do everybody a favor by never going on your newly found, "internet" and go back to the log cabin from whense you came


total jerk (5.00 / 1) (#44)
by nathan on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 05:53:14 PM PST
lower-class jobs (no insult to any who may hold the positions named)

A bit late for that, chum.

Nathan
--
Li'l Sis: Yo, that's a real grey area. Even by my lax standards.

 
I love my children (5.00 / 1) (#48)
by T Reginald Gibbons on Wed Jan 23rd, 2002 at 12:05:17 AM PST
Perhaps you don't understand a father's love for his child. I can only assume that your father did not love you as openly as I love my sons and daughters.

I also understand that my children are just that: children. They are impressionable. It is wrong to expect seventeen year old children to make life-changing decisions, such as what to do for a career. This is not something that can be taken lightly. I make these decisions for my children, to give them the benefit of my years of experience. Only I can make the right choices for them. If I didn't, they might follow some fad or trend they've heard of, and end up pursuing a meaningless career in a dehumanized field like computers.


I largely agree with you but (1.00 / 1) (#49)
by Anonymous Reader on Wed Jan 23rd, 2002 at 06:59:14 AM PST
your children do need a career. I'm currently seeking assistance to exploit a parallel universe. Perhaps your eldest may like to try an internship in this exciting enterprise. Reply here.


 
I agree with the "total jerk" up to a po (1.00 / 1) (#52)
by budlite on Thu Jan 24th, 2002 at 07:57:13 AM PST
I'm not going to deny that you love your children, but you seem to be doing your best to force them into roles in life that YOU want for them, not what THEY want. I think you should let them make their own decisions. They know what they're interested in doing for a living, and while they may not know EXACTLY the career they want to take up, they should at least be given the opportunity to become educated to allow them to take up a position in their chosen field.

It's your duty as a parent to GUIDE them, not force them into some mould you think is fitting. Let them make their own decisions. Ultimately it's their life, not yours. Let them live it how they want to.


P.S. Your son isn't a computer hacker, and if that article wasn't a parody then I can safely say that your knowledge of computers is well below the level that qualifies you to make such a post. I'm not trying to start an argument here, but I felt that needed to be said.


 
or not (none / 0) (#79)
by Anonymous Reader on Sat Feb 2nd, 2002 at 05:28:10 PM PST
You are sadly mistaken, you have NO control over your children, they can do WHAT they want and you cannot do ANYTHING ABOUT IT


 
17 year olds are not children (none / 0) (#81)
by goblin on Tue Feb 5th, 2002 at 09:47:13 PM PST
while we might treat 17-or-so-olds as children in this day and age, that is a perspective based on a culture that allows a little more irresponsablity of its younger members than has been the historical norm, and a high average life span. while we might define those of, say 20+ as adults, for most of the worlds history the eldest majority of the global population (the adults) was generally no older than their 20's. by that standard 17-year-olds are most certaintly not children. while i concede that the 17's of our society are not as well equiped for responsablity as their historic predessecors in terms of upbringing (not a comment on anyones parenting, its a logical and hard to avoid consequence of living in such a wealthy nation as the u.s.)those historic 17 year olds pretty much had to either learn from themselves or others who would only have attained a similar age. from this the conclusion can only be that a person of 17 years is more than capable of making many of their own decisions, far more than you are allowing your children


 
Question... (none / 0) (#82)
by Anonymous Reader on Fri Feb 8th, 2002 at 02:22:23 PM PST
After reading the computer hacker and laughing out loud for 45 minutes giving the link to all my friends, I must ask...
Do your children hate you?


 
Your child (none / 0) (#85)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 12th, 2002 at 03:04:50 PM PST
WOW! Making decisions for your seventeen year old "child" LOL! I'm sorry, but by the time your child is seventeen, he/she has already made many "life-changing decisions!" Drugs, HACKING, etc. You cannot make a decision like what your child wants to do as a career for them. And for your information, the computer field is one of the greatest fields you can enter in this day in age. You are obviously a overprotecting father that doesn't know jack Sh*t about kids and what they need. You realize that if you sit around your seventeen year old "child" very long, they aren't going to have a thing called Stree-smarts! I'm sure that you love your kids and you want to protect them and care for them for the rest of your life, but you must realize that your "child" is only a year or less from being an ADULT! Yes, renting pornos, going to strip clubs, if you didn't mention that your child was 17, I would have thought you were talking about a kid who is 5 years old! You may want to reconsider what the hell you think "hacking" is because your obviously wrong there when I read your other post. LOL, there are over 4500 posts replying to how INACCURATE your information is. AMD=hacker processor?

New ISP besides AOL? AOL SUCKS BAD...better question is who doesn't want to get rid of AOL!

Hacking will land you in jail, etc....NO...hacking will actually land you a job if your good at it. You can help defend from other attacks! Hacking is not illegal unless you break into sites, if your using hacking for your own personal use, on your computer, simply to learn more about computers, THAT'S NOT HACKING!

Quake=haxor game...LOL LOL....hold on, one more LOL.....Quake is a game....hear that, GAME....not hacker meeting place! LOL

New Video Card means son is hacker.....NO...hacking has nothing to do with your video card LOL

Well, your simply a over protecting father. You can't change that. You love your children. Which most parents do. You also mentioned that you were the greatest family in America, but I wont get into that. However, let your kid be a kid, for christ sakes, one of them is only a year from being an adult and they most likely dont know what alcohol is, sneaking out of the house, etc. Your kids are more likely to be killed on the streets or doing illegal things because of you being to overprotecting. Your NOT, I repeat, NOT a "model parent!" No model parent would keep their kids from growing up even when they are 17! I wish your children good luck in the future and I hope they get a life before you take it from them, then again, that's already happened :) Peace...


 
you moron (none / 0) (#99)
by Anonymous Reader on Sat May 11th, 2002 at 11:39:39 PM PST
HAHA, 17 year olds are not children, a youth from ages 14 or lower is possibly a child. But at 7 years old i vowed myself to strive towards the accomplishment of getting into such a prestigise college as MIT.

You are a fool, now go back to the mountains, build yourself a cabin, and please... never come back to society


 
thankyou (1.00 / 1) (#56)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Jan 24th, 2002 at 08:29:21 PM PST
thankyou for giving me a ray of hope for a free america amongst the very real signs that the citizens of america are becoming fools interested only in their social status. Are you from america? if so, you are the only american i have come across that has an independant opinion. i congratulate you, and i sincerely hope america does not fall back into a brainwashed society. As for the facist who wrote the column, let your children have opinions and encourage them to break through the shell of ignorance and steriotypical values.


 
The truth Behind the huge article (none / 0) (#86)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue Feb 12th, 2002 at 09:56:33 PM PST
This is done out of the kinddness of my heart.

This person who posts these Articles which get everyone so pissed off is just messing with your heads. He has concealed his identity reasonably well on the "internet". Now for those of you who have read the "Is your son a computer hacker" article you should have made note that if in fact a person that stupid did exsist they would by no means be able to conceal themselves let alone spell some of the words in the article. You can decide for yourselves what you think of this person. I believe it's a rather clever hoax and also would like to give credit to the person writing them for having way more free time than I do:)


 
I agree (none / 0) (#101)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue May 28th, 2002 at 07:03:21 AM PST
word
this guy is retarded and deeply philistine


 
possession (5.00 / 2) (#46)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 09:32:21 PM PST
You're right about these insidious 'college' places. Your children might learn something there -- perhaps even enough to make their own decisions. You must do all that is in your power to prevent this. I think you should take that final step, and leash them (or just tie them up in the basement) to prevent them from getting away from you.

I followed the link in your article for 'lawyer'. Of all the links you could have used for lawyer I think this one is quite telling. On the third page of that article, I found the following quote: "The pleasure in the constant domination over another person is the very essence of the sadistic drive."

I was being sarcastic with the 'tie them up' remark, but I wonder now, would that really be a stretch for you? It's fairly obvious that you've crossed the line between protection and possession, mr gibbons.

-iconoclast


 
The humble opinion from the campus (1.00 / 1) (#47)
by Anonymous Reader on Tue Jan 22nd, 2002 at 10:53:06 PM PST
Mr. Gibbons -

You make some interesting points. Our society is more open about some things, and it makes you, as well as many parents of children they hope will become "good upstanding citizens," nervous.

First, allow me to address your view of the modern college. You seem to understand that every kind of person exists on the typical college campus. What you seem to fail to comprehend is that this includes the "good upstanding citizens" that you want your kids to keep company with. I attend a small, private college in the South. And while our student body consists of only 5000 undergraduates, I have many friends who have a) not touched alcohol, b) have not had sex or even thought about it, and c) attend church/synagogue/mosque/whatever on a regular basis. My roommate attends Bible study sessions three or more times a week. There are organizations on campus devoted to religious practice, to community service, and other such "virtuous" activities.

You are wrong to think that we collegians are all depraved animals. We're not. Some of us are good people.

That having been said, there are the "deviants" that you may want to "protect" your children against. Here, you just have to trust your children. What happened to Blair happens a lot to children whose curiosity about other value systems and other views of the world are stringently repressed, and who come from sheltered lives where the know not about the existence of what you refer to as "nonconformists."

I hope you have educated your children about that in which you do not want them to engage. If you haven't, they are in the group ripest to deviate from the path that you have set for them.

You have already made a dangerous error by isolating your children from Blair. You have invoked what I refer to as the Bernard Effect, one of the most powerful sociological phenomena that I have observed. It is the allure of the forbidden; things that are unilaterally disallowed by some sort of authority figure immediately become irresistibly appealing. It is named for St. Bernard, who went around in the 12th (I think) century and called playing cards the Devil's work - popularizing playing cards in the process. Reverse this: don't disallow anything, but educate well on what is good, what is bad, and why.

You must face this fact: your children are going to have to go out into the world eventually. Are you going to sacrifice their opportunity for success by denying them the benefits that come from a college education? Or are you going to keep up your futile attempts to shelter your children from the real world, only to have it mercilessly crush your shelter later on? Is that love?

"Don't lock up something that you wanted to see fly." - Chris Cornell. How are your children going to become "good upstanding citizens" if you don't even let them become citizens?

Of course, I don't have children of my own. I speak only from the experience of having been one somewhat recently. Believe me, forbidding something is the worst way of going about preventing it. There is something in the youthful mindset that rebels against that. Short of a strategic lobotomy, you're not going to change that nature.

I want to make one more point. So your child goes out into the world and falls short of your expectations. Would you be able to accept it if your children developed opinions that differ from your own? Chances are that they already have. And finally, what is the problem with that? We are all different. Trying to raise someone who thinks exactly the same as you, acts exactly the same as you, and believes exactly the same as you is ridiculous. The most a parent can do is to help them grow, to develop their own opinions, and to make sure that they have good intentions when the world is unleashed upon them.

What can you do to make sure your children don't go "astray"? Well, you can pray. Or you can open your own mind... maybe that which you see as "astray" really isn't that far off the beaten path after all.


 
Cowardice (5.00 / 1) (#50)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Jan 24th, 2002 at 06:47:53 AM PST
Quite right on the cowardice. Its about time we instated National Service. In fact, surely you're missing the point here, before your children can go to grow as true individuals working in the nation's industries, you should first press them into the service of the Nation.
The only way to put moral backbone into them and create truly fulfilled and happy citizens is to put your children in the front line of the fight against terrorism, and sign them up for their Army service. Only then will they have the perspective required to make a contribution to our great democracy. These college liberals shouldn't be allowed to pass comment until they too have taken up arms to defend our freedom.


wrong (none / 0) (#108)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Jul 15th, 2002 at 03:33:21 AM PST
why do you say that people must take up arms to defend your national freedom? isn't it just as good to help keep the industries working smoothly so that people do not starve, or lack basic equipment? i would have thought that is as noble a cause as being in the military. why do you call the people who you call upon for all of your basic services cowards? i think that that is really quite a horrible thing to say.


 
You say that you love your children? (1.00 / 1) (#53)
by Anonymous Reader on Thu Jan 24th, 2002 at 03:54:25 PM PST
Please, Reggie, dont lie.

First off, you say you show your love by making all the decisions for your children and not letting them go to college. And then you tell some person you have most likely never met that their parents obviously didnt show them their love as openly as you do? How exactly in the blue hell do you know anything about this person, except that they disagree with you? Nothing at all.

You're going to tell your children to work in steel mills? A slightly amusing thought enters my mind, Reggie. A thought that, perhaps, T Reginald Gibbons is a 15 year old with raging hormones who is a general smartass who likes to piss people off.

So is this true, Reggie? No parent would want their children to honestly work in a steel mill, or at a McDonald's, or some half-assed "beauty" parlor as you suggest.

Eventually your "children" need to make their own decisions. Its called part of growing up. Let them choose a college, let them go, and if they get into trouble, as long as its not life-threatening or they are being beaten or raped or something, let them take a little heat before bailing them out. It will be a "learning experience."

My own children had their careers mapped out when they were in their late 20s, when most people make their career choices. My son decided he wanted to write, so he worked until he was 32 and went back to college, got a degree in journalism, and now is happily working for a comfortable wage at some paper in Kansas, last I heard. My daughter decided to do something in engineering, she went back to college at 27, got her degree, and now is working for a construction company in San Francisco, making a very comfortable wage.

Im proud of my children, and Im proud that when they got into trouble the first time at the adolescent age, I let them take the fall. When the dust settled (not there was that much dust), they were all fine, and I, although I looked diligently for trouble, never found any.

Once they hit 18, Reggie, they choose for themselves. If they have the money to go to college and want to go, they do.

So, Reggie, how's that XBox? I hear its pretty popular among you 15 year olds.


Snob. (5.00 / 2) (#54)