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Do you stare with fascination when you see a real tank in the street?
Yes 36%
No Don't Look Much 9%
Stare With Dread 9%
Stare With Numbness 18%
Run Like Hell 27%

Votes: 11

 I Am Not A Pacifist - Taliban Must Go - We Must Rebuild Afghanistan Afterward

 Author:  Topic:  Posted:
Oct 20, 2001
Deep down ever since I was a little boy, history was my favorite subject and war my favorite game, along with building cities and drawing pictures of war and cities. I grew up steeping myself in the details of ww2 hardware and campaigns, especially in the european theater. I can read and study maps for hours contentedly. I am sometimes transfixed, less so now that I am more mature, by the sight of actual real live military hardware in the steel.

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So after viewing this panel discussion by refugee Afghan intellectuals on the World Link satellite channel combined with DW footage from in country, I am re-convinced that the Taliban are fascist scum and must be ejected using force as the last resort. Yeah war {said not very enthusiastically}.

The pipeline project to end-run Iran and bring oil into the Indian Ocean through Pakistan was supposed to be made secure by the Taliban. It was already in the works in the mid-90's. That is why the US initially listened to Pakistan and Unocal and helped the Taliban secure their hold against the other competing groups in post-Soviet Akxhuystan. When Bin Laden fled there in 96 and Pakistan set off their nuke test in 98, the US realized it had blundered again. I probably don't know nearly enough details about this but I did come across a July 2001 grilling by a right-wing congressman from CA of two State Dept. people about our misleading the Northern Alliance into relaxing their posture while Pakistan was resupplying and rearming the Talib for a new offensive against them. He accused State of being either incompetent or duplicitous.

To get anything close to stability after the devastation of the war is going to take a big expensive rebuilding project and drawing enough of the educated Afghans who fled the country for obvious reasons to come back and rebuild and run it. We pay to destroy it. We pay to rebuild it. We will have lots of help paying to rebuild from Saudi and Kuwait I hope if it is phrased properly. If we do what we did last time when the Sovs got ejected and fail to stay involved in peaceful rebuilding, it might bite us again. Meanwhile it looks like a deal to bring the Caspian Oil out through Rossiya has been struck.

Why was that a hard deal to strike before I would like to know? Does the deal involve a bigger aid package to Russia?, NATO inclusion?, simple baksheesh to the right oligarchs affiliated with Gazneftprom?, simple acceptance of the brutal any means and all means necessary to subdue Chechnya (good luck eh?). Bunch of questions.


Tanks (none / 0) (#1)
by First Incision on Sat Oct 20th, 2001 at 09:13:38 AM PST
This is in response to your poll. Yes, I have always been fascinated by military hardware. (Although I haven't seen a "tank in the street" since a post-Desert Storm parade. But I went into the medical field partially because of my fascination of the ability of technology to cure and aid people. Violence and killing is very foreign to me, and in fighting blades, guns and other war machines, I see the other side of the coin. They are devices designed to modify the biological functioning of a human body, but in the opposite direction.
Do you suffer from late-night hacking? Ask your doctor about Protonix.

Cement Mixers (none / 0) (#4)
by Inden on Sat Oct 20th, 2001 at 12:33:03 PM PST
And my ex goes glassy eyed and silent when she sees a moving cement mixer drive by!

Hardware is wonderful! Even the suits of armor from the middle ages in the museum and the beautiful inlaid wooden handles of the 16th century Ottoman muskets!

Yet I will still be found among the protesters advocating awareness of non-violence and thinking twice before glorifying militarism at the local air show.

Go figger.

I hope you are not suggesting for one minute (none / 0) (#2)
by Anonymous Reader on Sat Oct 20th, 2001 at 09:31:52 AM PST
That this war has anything to do with control of the Oil supply ?

I am sure you are aware, that adequacy does not tolerate trolling, even in its diary sections, so I hope you will set the record straight and confirm that this war is directed against Osama Bin Laden and his fascist fundamentalists because they are terrorists, and not because their land is of strategic significance to those who want to move Oil from A to B.

thank you

from one Reader to another... (none / 0) (#3)
by Anonymous Reader on Sat Oct 20th, 2001 at 09:46:25 AM PST
are you sure that at no point in time our government (USA! USA!) will be interested in moving oil from A to B?

You are solely deluded. (none / 0) (#5)
by tkatchev on Sat Oct 20th, 2001 at 12:35:13 PM PST
You are solely deluded if you think "foreign aid" to Russia (i.e. Gazprom) is going to help. You simply don't have enough money. These guys are plying in a whole other ballpark; this is too big for the U.S. government. Your only hope is if you get Time-Warner-AOL involved. Though I personally doubt that Time-Warner-AOL is interested in joining the oil trade.

P.S. Chechnya is a chronic problem. The war in Chechnya has been going on for at least two hundred years now, possibly more. What you need to realise is that it's not an imperialistic war -- Russia really doesn't need Chechnya. It's simply that Chechnya is a clan-based society that still practices slavery. When such a society is stuck to your southern border, it is a time-bomb set to go off. Which it does with frightening regularity.

Peace and much love...

your opinions on Russia (none / 0) (#8)
by Anonymous Reader on Sun Oct 21st, 2001 at 02:05:21 PM PST
are extremely laughable.

I was litterally filling the air with my raucous guffaws.

We (as in Americans) don't need your help to run your country. We don't need it and we don't want it.

You Russians should mind your own business and let America do its job.

Oh yeah. (none / 0) (#9)
by tkatchev on Sun Oct 21st, 2001 at 09:53:31 PM PST
D00d, you are out of touch with reality. You can now go back to ingesting bovine growth hormone and watching "sailor moon" pornography.

Peace and much love...

This is not slashdot (none / 0) (#10)
by Anonymous Reader on Mon Oct 22nd, 2001 at 11:31:28 AM PST
How come kids think it's so smart to use numbers instead of letters?

"D00d," do you realise how stupid that makes you sound?

Perhaps your "133713" friends think you are cool when you put letters instead of words but around here we think it makes you look like a moron.

Sigh. (none / 0) (#11)
by tkatchev on Mon Oct 22nd, 2001 at 12:18:42 PM PST
Sarcasm alert. But, you're American, right? That must explain it.

One must always remember to speak in simple, easily digestible phrases when speaking to an American. Maybe it is the bovine growth hormone showing its ugly face, after all? Who knows.

P.S. Have you considered a vegetarian diet? Just remeber to eat lots of calcium and phosphorus.

Peace and much love...

DELETE PARENT POST! (5.00 / 1) (#12)
by error27 on Mon Oct 22nd, 2001 at 05:04:36 PM PST
tkatchev, I don't know what kind of sick person you are, but the controversial web site frowns on murder.

Advising people to eat phosphorous is NOT funny in the least.

Perhaps you were not completely sure as to the reason they put a skull and cross bones on a bottle of phosphorous. The reason is exactly so that people will NOT injest it or advise other people to injest it.

Please stop trying to murder people via the interweb or I shall have to report you to the FBI.

Inden must be tired. (none / 0) (#6)
by RobotSlave on Sun Oct 21st, 2001 at 12:17:44 PM PST
At a paltry 400+, this is one of the weakest efforts we have seen yet, certainly not up to the standards of the submission queue at Insufficient for inducing so much as a light nap.

© 2002, RobotSlave. You may not reproduce this material, in whole or in part, without written permission of the owner.

Proper diet and sleep is key. (none / 0) (#7)
by tkatchev on Sun Oct 21st, 2001 at 12:37:44 PM PST
I think he needs to get some more sleep, and eat a more balanced carbohydrate diet; the success is probably getting to his head. It is important to not overestimate your strength.

Peace and much love...


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